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drakcapusus Advanced Member
Joined: 07 Sep 2007 Posts: 326
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Posted: Sun Nov 11, 2007 10:04 pm Post subject: |
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Yes, I do have DSL. But you and I aren't the only ones in this state. You don't think that other providers will come in? You don't think that will bring the cost down?
I don't have a cell phone. Don't need one, couldn't afford one if I did. Your beefin about a $2.00 charge, which I can't find on my phone bill by the way? What about the fees and charges for you cell? Why do you have a land line if you have cell, which has internet service?
You don't like petition drives so we all should just shut up and follow the powers that be? All of rural Nebraska shouldn't have a better choice of service?
mailto:petition@usepublicpower.com
Drop them a line. |
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WhimpyPeon Advanced Member
Joined: 08 Jun 2005 Posts: 1229 Location: Columbus, NE
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Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2007 1:36 pm Post subject: |
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From internic whois database:
| Quote: | Domain Name: USEPUBLICPOWER.COM
Registrar: NETWORK SOLUTIONS, LLC.
Whois Server: whois.networksolutions.com
Referral URL: http://www.networksolutions.com
Name Server: BERTHA.MEGAVISION.COM
Name Server: OLGA.MEGAVISION.COM
Status: clientTransferProhibited
Updated Date: 14-aug-2007
Creation Date: 14-aug-2007
Expiration Date: 14-aug-2009 |
It looks like another Megavision petition to me.
Trust me, a Columbus subscriber is paying in the range of $2.00 per month for Leigh calling. I read about it in the paper and noticed the change in my bill at the time. You could call Frontier if you want.
I don't get my Internet through Alltel. I get mine through Time Warner and Roadrunner. I just pointed out Alltel as an alternative for rural people.
I have a land line and a cell phone. The cell phone is for emergencies while on the road and other convenience. I keep a minimal plan.
I don't have a problem with petitions, I do have a problem when the same people are doing it over and over and over again.
If you have read my previous posts you would note that I don't feel strongly one way or another about this, other than I am concerned that we are giving an unfair edge (public power and their infrastructure) over the others that have to fund their ventures and infrastructure through profit.
Not too long ago I remember watching a City Council meeting where Frontier's proposal to establish a city wide mesh of wireless Internet met serious objections from Megavision. The reason... radio interference and a somewhat exclusive agreement between the City and Frontier. Doesn't that strike you as a little similar to what my objection was to this proposal?
I have had cable Internet service since it was the first broadband option in town. Now there are many different alternatives. My bill is still the same, so competition does not necessarily mean discount.
Actually, I don't have a problem with BPL (other than the possible radio interference) as long as there is open usage of OUR infrastructure. If everyone has similarly priced access (as a provider) this is fine. If there is any form of exclusive contract with a provider I have a problem. If the public power companies provide cheap Internet and hide the costs on a power bill I have a problem. Is your desire for cheap Internet so strong that you are willing to stifle fair competition? _________________ Have soapbox will travel! |
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Imwithstupid Advanced Member
Joined: 20 Aug 2005 Posts: 1868 Location: Shermer, Illinois
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Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2007 7:05 pm Post subject: |
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| WhimpyPeon wrote: | | If there is any form of exclusive contract with a provider I have a problem. |
Like the contract Time Warner has with the city to be the exclusive cable provider? _________________
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If you rob Peter to pay Paul, you can always count on Paul's vote ~ Democrat strategy |
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Power to the People Advanced Member
Joined: 01 Dec 2006 Posts: 55
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Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2007 9:43 pm Post subject: |
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| WhimpyPeon wrote: | From internic whois database:
Domain Name: USEPUBLICPOWER.COM
Registrar: NETWORK SOLUTIONS, LLC.
Whois Server: whois.networksolutions.com
Referral URL: http://www.networksolutions.com
Name Server: BERTHA.MEGAVISION.COM
Name Server: OLGA.MEGAVISION.COM
Status: clientTransferProhibited
Updated Date: 14-aug-2007
Creation Date: 14-aug-2007
Expiration Date: 14-aug-2009
It looks like another Megavision petition to me.
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Does this mean Behlen is part of Megavision?
| Quote: |
Registrant:
Domain Name: BEHLENMFG.COM
Administrative Contact , Technical Contact :
Behlen Mfg. Co.
support@MEGAVISION.COM
PO Box 159
Columbus, NE 68602-0159 US
Phone: 402 562-5904
Record expires on 15-May-2008
Record created on 14-May-1996
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No, I don't think so. What it does mean is the site is hosted at Megavision. Of course if you would have read the petition you would know who is sponsoring it.
| WhimpyPeon wrote: |
Trust me, a Columbus subscriber is paying in the range of $2.00 per month for Leigh calling. I read about it in the paper and noticed the change in my bill at the time. You could call Frontier if you want.
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Maybe you should have called Fronteir. The additional $2.00 is paid by Leigh Frontier users, not Columbus. It was set in place to give Leigh users toll-free calling to Columbus. The addition to Columbus users was $0.05. This was voted on by the Leigh users. It was put in place by the PSC, not Megavision.
| WhimpyPeon wrote: |
Not too long ago I remember watching a City Council meeting where Frontier's proposal to establish a city wide mesh of wireless Internet met serious objections from Megavision. The reason... radio interference and a somewhat exclusive agreement between the City and Frontier. Doesn't that strike you as a little similar to what my objection was to this proposal?
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Have you Googled this lately? How many other cities bit off on this? You don't have to trust me on this, do it for yourself.
| WhimpyPeon wrote: |
I have had cable Internet service since it was the first broadband option in town. Now there are many different alternatives. My bill is still the same, so competition does not necessarily mean discount.
Actually, I don't have a problem with BPL (other than the possible radio interference) as long as there is open usage of OUR infrastructure. If everyone has similarly priced access (as a provider) this is fine. If there is any form of exclusive contract with a provider I have a problem. If the public power companies provide cheap Internet and hide the costs on a power bill I have a problem. Is your desire for cheap Internet so strong that you are willing to stifle fair competition? |
You talk about stifling the competition. Have you asked what service providers you can get on cable? Let's see, they told me 3, Time-Warner, Earthlink, and I-Nebraska. So your money can be reinvested in every place BUT Columbus, NE. It's all about choice. No one is saying this is the right plan, the wrong plan, but what it does do is give you and I a choice to use something WE are supposed to own. |
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Phreakwars Advanced Member
Joined: 05 Sep 2006 Posts: 3575 Location: newsucks500.com
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Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2007 11:56 pm Post subject: |
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Ahh the poor baby HAM radio hobbyist are hearing noise... whoopty do. I think perhaps they should realize HAM radios are fossil technology as well (progress hindering bastards). There are much faster ways to transmit and receive a signal these days. Yes I realize there is more to HAM radio then just the hobbyist, it is used by government agencies as well. I think it can be utilized as a backup EBS in case the electrical infrastructure fails. And as was stated before, that stupid grid Frontier wanted to put up would have caused interference as well (In addition to STEALING people with home wireless router's operating frequency) . What this tells me, is these same lobbyist from the phone company and what have you who are complaining about interference, are kind of hypocrites now aren't they? I have faith in the power of progressive technology to solve the interference problem. How else is the technology to fix the problem going to be fixed except to have a substantial cash flow coming in from satisfied customers to feed the research effort. The overall advantage outweighs the disadvantage here.
| Quote: | | 2) Would we be giving unfair advantages to public entities (power companies) which are publicly owned. They would be selling service over infrastructure that was paid for with public power money. They could further hide Internet costs in your power bill while building a high speed infrastructure. Other companies that provide Internet have to put their costs on the Internet customer or other privately funded venture. |
And you don't think the power companies don't already do the same? I don't know about the local companies, but many of the power providers own stock in other companies. I like to call these "buddy buddy, shoulder rub" stock. It actually HAS to be done.. Look at frontier and Dish Network.
2 technologies that had to merge to compete with 1.. CABLE.
I believe this was only a minor merger for what is to come. The fact remains here... You can beam a signal from the sky, and you can send it over a tiny cable, but the strongest signal is those big, thick power lines that are strung out all over America. They can do it all... Power your home, make a phone call, receive a HD-TV signal with probably more channels then all the other competitors combined if they choose, and surf the net many X faster then Time Warner could muster, WIRELESS in your home.. to make this a sexual innuendo, if I'm swinging a thick cable all over the neighborhood that has the potential to satisfy every one's needs, then the guy with the thin wire has a good reason to start biting his nails and worrying.
| Quote: | 3) Having public power in Nebraska these companies are similar to government agencies. The government should not compete with private industry.
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Ahh hell, the government already owns the damn Internet. It's high time we start knowing our role and letting them control the juice too.
OK that was sarcasm.
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. _________________ http://justbs.us/
Conservative chat & debate forum.
Moderated by ImWithStupid. Administrated, by me. |
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WhimpyPeon Advanced Member
Joined: 08 Jun 2005 Posts: 1229 Location: Columbus, NE
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Posted: Tue Nov 13, 2007 1:46 pm Post subject: |
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Ok, like I said, I don't feel strongly one way or another here, so here is my (probably) last comment.
IWS,
Time Warner has an exclusive contract with an expiration on that contract. I think a city has to have these types of contracts in order to keep cables hanging from poles or buried in people's yards to a minimum. Last week TW had to re-run a cable to the building next to mine. The digger's hot line people were out marking and flagging. My back yard had flags and painted lines all over the place.
Further, TW paid for all of the infrastructure that they currently use.
PTTP,
You are right, a whois was probably a bad idea.
Here is the actual petition.
I think Mr Schumacher and Ms Aerni are very good business people and they were the first to bring Internet to Columbus. I just think their involvement in business ventures through petition is a little high.
Here is a simple google search for petition and Paul Schumacher
After reading your response on the Columbus/Leigh thing you are right (as I said I was going from memory). Every subscriber in Columbus is still paying a nickle a month for something most didn't ask for. Dig a little deeper and I thing you will find that MV was behind that effort as well.
I didn't say the frontier proposal was good or bad, I just pointed out that MV complained about it. I didn't like the proposal myself.
Again, I don't have a problem with the whole BPL thing as long as there are not any "sweatheart deals" given to some and excluding others. Being a public power state, the stockholders should be given fair representation of our infrastructure. I would also like to know that if I am in the country and need a COP/Fire Truck/Ambulance that my phone and their radios will work.
drak,
Please don't confuse your desire for cheap rural broadband with some kind of right. You chose to live in the country which is fine, but don't expect those living in communities to pay the bill. I would like a Lexus, but guess what I can't afford that either. I would like my neighborhood to be more quiet at night, however that's the hazard of city life. Each lifestyle has it's advantages and disadvantages. _________________ Have soapbox will travel! |
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drakcapusus Advanced Member
Joined: 07 Sep 2007 Posts: 326
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Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 10:40 am Post subject: |
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[quote]drak,
Please don't confuse your desire for cheap rural broadband with some kind of right. You chose to live in the country which is fine, but don't expect those living in communities to pay the bill. I would like a Lexus, but guess what I can't afford that either. I would like my neighborhood to be more quiet at night, however that's the hazard of city life. Each lifestyle has it's advantages and disadvantages. | Quote: |
Whimpy, please elaborate further on how you've come to the conclusion that I believe that rural access at a competitive price is a "right". Elaborate on how those living in communities will pay the bill. By the way, don't you think that All of Nebraska would benefit?
If we had BPL they wouldn't have had to dig up your yard.
I wouldn't like any "sweetheart deals" either. Time Warner has one in Columbus. Frontier wanted one too. Your playing the devils advocate pretty well. And thank you for the links.
A comment was made in the Lincoln Journal Star that said all the people in the rural areas should move to the city and stop complaining about slow connection speeds and the like. Perhaps we should..Then we could just shrug our shoulders when he asked, what's for supper........ |
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drakcapusus Advanced Member
Joined: 07 Sep 2007 Posts: 326
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Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 10:41 am Post subject: |
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| The quote thing back fired.......... |
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Old Salt Advanced Member
Joined: 07 Jan 2007 Posts: 2015 Location: Permanent Vacation
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Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 10:53 am Post subject: |
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| drakcapusus wrote: | | The quote thing back fired.......... |
If you use the preview function, you can find out if the quote is correct before you post. At least that's what I've found. |
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WhimpyPeon Advanced Member
Joined: 08 Jun 2005 Posts: 1229 Location: Columbus, NE
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Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 12:20 pm Post subject: |
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| drakcapusus wrote: | | Whimpy, please elaborate further on how you've come to the conclusion that I believe that rural access at a competitive price is a "right". |
Uhhh... perhaps when you said..
| drakcapusus wrote: | | I live 4 miles outside of Columbus. I either had to make due with 28kb(?) dial up, pay $400 for wireless equipment. Took me a year to get Frontier to try DSL out here. They had to take down, I believe, 3 load filters(?) to get it here. If the rent goes up, my DSL is gone. Being all but house bound that means I loose my window on life. I'm sure there are many more households that would benefit from access but can't afford it or are limited by choice. |
Boo Hoo.
| drakcapusus wrote: | | Elaborate on how those living in communities will pay the bill. By the way, don't you think that All of Nebraska would benefit? | Because you are using an infrastructure that we (partially) own. The residents of communities pay for more than their share of infrastructure costs (consider the storm last winter) where utilities had to replace several poles and long wire runs for each rural home. Face it, the infrastructure cost per home in rural areas is considerably higher than for those in communities. The higher costs are not reflected in your KWH price.
I don't mind paying more than my share for rural Nebraska because my family has rural roots, and rural Nebraska does other things for the metro areas. It balances out.
How do communities pay the bill? As I said before we support the infrastructure that will carry your BPL. I don't have a problem opening up this infrastructure as long as it is open to anyone who wants to use it and it doesn't interfere with other communications systems. I would also like to see more information on the fine details. I think the details were left out of this petition to make sure certain entities could exploit it for their own purposes. If the power company wants to sell Internet and pass their costs on to the INTERNET customers, I don't have a problem as long as it is done solely by the power company.
If you aren't careful who you crawl into bed with you may end up with crabs.
| drakcapusus wrote: | | If we had BPL they wouldn't have had to dig up your yard. |
Thanks for the news flash, but that wasn't my point.
| drakcapusus wrote: | | I wouldn't like any "sweetheart deals" either. Time Warner has one in Columbus. Frontier wanted one too. Your playing the devils advocate pretty well. And thank you for the links. |
Time Warner did get a good contract. They did, however, string up fiber optic cables all over town at what I would guess is a pretty high cost (built their own infrastructure), I would guess that kind of investment would require some guarantees.
I said earlier I didn't support the Frontier plan.
| drakcapusus wrote: | | A comment was made in the Lincoln Journal Star that said all the people in the rural areas should move to the city and stop complaining about slow connection speeds and the like. Perhaps we should..Then we could just shrug our shoulders when he asked, what's for supper........ |
Not sure what your point here is.
As I said earlier, living in town has it's benefits and so does living in the country. It is your choice to select which "package" you prefer. _________________ Have soapbox will travel! |
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drakcapusus Advanced Member
Joined: 07 Sep 2007 Posts: 326
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Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 3:15 pm Post subject: |
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I was just stating my experience.
I'm a little confused Whimpy.
Do you think community dwellers have different basic bills than rural dwellers? You do have added bills living in Columbus, but like you have said, that is your choice. We all pay for the storm damage. Do you know how much it costs the home owner to have a line run to their home? It's far from cheap and comes out of the home owners pocket - not yours. How did you get so miss guided on this? Are you so hell bent on being a martyr that pays for everybody that you make these things up?
I can't believe you seriously believe most of what you write.
BPL doesn't stop at the city limits, just as the power lines don't.
I'll leave you with a reminder....
The purpose of the petition is to put to a vote by the people the question of allowing public powers to run BPL. Put it to a vote. |
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WhimpyPeon Advanced Member
Joined: 08 Jun 2005 Posts: 1229 Location: Columbus, NE
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Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 4:57 pm Post subject: |
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No martyr here. Just the guy who reads the petition:
| Quote: | | In addition to all other power and authority granted by law and to the extent not in conflict with federal law, public power companies are authorized to provide all forms of telecommunications, including, but not limited to, telephone, cable, broadband, Internet, data transmission, and information services, for a fee on a wholesale or retail basis to customers within their service areas. Public power companies shall have such additional powers as are necessary and proper for carrying into execution the powers provided in this subsection, specifically including, but not limited to, the power to construct, operate, and maintain facilities for transmissions between their service areas and other service areas or public or private telecommunications networks and to enter into agreements, partnerships, or other arrangements with private and public entities for the provision of services. | It looks to me as though the electric customer pays for this whether they use it or not. It also looks to me like they can partner up with whoever they feel like and give them MY money to pay for YOUR high speed Internet and then charge you.
Why do you suppose this is going through petition? Because most people will not read the small print and think Internet for the masses is a good thing. Because rural people are so desperate for a good broadband alternative they will sign anything. Because our caring legislature would not give away such an asinine "cookie" to the power companies and ISP's. Because the current ban on "public" internet providers is set to expire in 2008 already. This is just a quick proposition meant to slip a fast one by the voters and legislature that gives away a financing source for Internet Providers so they will not have to lay out the infrastructure costs.
I think not. I think something more like put it to bed! _________________ Have soapbox will travel! |
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RoadRunner Advanced Member
Joined: 17 Apr 2007 Posts: 270
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Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 5:27 pm Post subject: |
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I’ve been watching this thread for a few days now. Wimpy got to the point I was waiting for. BPL and internet to the masses is only a small part of this issue, just a ruse to make the consumer see a value, NPPD has hundreds of miles of dark fiber that they can’t do anything with and would just love to be able to let other entities use, possibly even free, but the law won’t allow it. Allowing this fiber and other telecommunications capabilities to be used may not be a bad thing, actually I can think of a number of possibilities that would actually save the taxpayers money. The problem is telecommunication industry is against this because of course who’s pocketbooks are going to be affected? I’m trying to see the benefit to Nebraska Lottery or Megavision for this to pass, after all they are also classified as a telephone company.  |
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plum_broke Advanced Member
Joined: 03 Nov 2007 Posts: 112
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Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 5:46 pm Post subject: |
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I am impressed - almost two pages of posts and no one has turned this into a concealed carry debate.
I do have to add that I would agree to some extent with WP, you choose where you live and when you choose where you live you also have to live with the options that are for you. I currently have Road Runner and I love it! I am with several who would love to pay to have wireless all over town, I too did not like the proposal that Frontier gave the city, so I will wait patiently and not complain. |
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Power to the People Advanced Member
Joined: 01 Dec 2006 Posts: 55
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Posted: Thu Nov 15, 2007 2:38 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | In addition to all other power and authority granted by law and to the extent not in conflict with federal law, public power companies are authorized to provide all forms of telecommunications, including, but not limited to, telephone, cable, broadband, Internet, data transmission, and information services, for a fee on a wholesale or retail basis to customers within their service areas. Public power companies shall have such additional powers as are necessary and proper for carrying into execution the powers provided in this subsection, specifically including, but not limited to, the power to construct, operate, and maintain facilities for transmissions between their service areas and other service areas or public or private telecommunications networks and to enter into agreements, partnerships, or other arrangements with private and public entities for the provision of services. |
| WhimpyPeon wrote: | | It looks to me as though the electric customer pays for this whether they use it or not. It also looks to me like they can partner up with whoever they feel like and give them MY money to pay for YOUR high speed Internet and then charge you. |
Just to clarify, what are you reading, or reading in to this WP? No one can go directly to the Internet except for Tier 1 providers. I don't think the power companies will become Tier 1 providers, thus the need to enter into agreement with whom? None other than the phone companies, the Tier 1 providers. Here is a list of Tier 1 providers as of Sept 1, 2007.
AOL Transit Data Network
AT&T
Global Crossing
Level 3
Verizon Business (formerly UUNET)
NTT Communications (formerly Verio)
Qwest
SAVVIS
SprintLink
TeliaSonera International Carrier
Not a huge list huh. All and all no matter what the outcome, the phone companies (the real phone companies) will still make money from this. It’s the transport and the ability to, that is the issue. |
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